Name calling: The Hack

[dwagman]

Name calling: The Hack

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[Al Myers]

Dan, Thanks for that info! That answered alot of questions that I had.

Willoughy in his book also used this word (Hocke) for the Hack Lift. Is that German as well, and does it have a different meaning?

I’m going to write a story for tomorrow that fully described how Hackenschmidt performed the “hack lift”. He did it much different than how we do it now. I’ll also try to find someone in the gym tonight that can properly demonstrate his technique for a picture – which might be hard as it requires tremendous flexibility! Al

[KCSTRONGMAN]

I just read a wrestling book by the russian lion last year. It was interesting, but not revolutionary (as I expect it would be difficult to be in a sport which dates to ancient civilizations). I did find it humourous that “Hack” referred to the headlock or head and arm as the “cross-buttock” and someone who was a proficient headlocker was known in the book as a “cross-buttocker”. I guess I would rather be known as having a good headlock.

I bit of trivia-Who was the Iowan to beat George Hackenschmidt like an impudent wife?

I'm the lyrical Jesse James

[dwagman]

Al, I’m going to look forward to your explanation. Talking about this has caused me to dust off my Superathletes book, one of my prized possessions.

If I may provide a photographic tip, you should have your model perform the lift wearing the sort of “shorts” Hack wore. hehehe

Yes, Hocke is also a German word. It refers to what we might consider crouching down or when you without weight go into a deep squat where your hamstrings touch your calves. You know, the sort of “move” you do when you poop in the woods.

Since you sort of hock down when you do a Hack sq/dl, it’s also feasible that this is where the name came from. But I would have to guess no on that one, too. The reason I say this is because Hackenschmidt didn’t seem to have spent a lot of time in Germany at all and because he lived primarily in London. With that in mind, and of course without knowing for sure, I would guess that people would just see him do stuff, whether he was the first to do it or not, and they’d probably go something like, “Hey, what’s Hack doing there? Let’s try that…” and then they just ended up calling the lift the Hack-whatever.

Regardless, personally, I like thinking of it as being a reference to Hackenschmidt. The dude was stout as all heck and had a body that people today, even when saucing, couldn’t get. And let’s not even talk about his strength and dominance in wrestling. He was from an era when men were men and it motivates me to do a Hack when thinking of him as opposed to my heel. Get my drift?

d

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[Al Myers]

HA ET – that trivia question is too easy so I’ll leave it for someone else.

I have another trivia question about ole Hack. We are giving him all kinds of credit for these two lifts, but what was the lift he SHOULD be remembered for??? It is by far his most remarkable strength feat. Dinoman

[dwagman]

I bit of trivia-Who was the Iowan to beat George Hackenschmidt like an impudent wife?

Was that Gotch? Hack really didn’t seem to like American wrestlers. But when Gotch kicked his ass, he had to change his mind. They had a rematch and Gotch whooped him again. But didn’t those fights back then last for hours? Do you know what became of Gotch?

Dan

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[dwagman]

Al, you referring to his jumping feats? He apparently did a back somersault with a 60-pound db in each hand.

Dan

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[KCSTRONGMAN]

Shawn Baeir went to his daughters school for something or another. He saw their show and tell wall and there was a pic of Gotch on it with an explanation of how it was this kids great great grandpa or something. I think Shawn plans on arranging a marriage
ET

I'm the lyrical Jesse James

[Scott Tully]

Karl Gotch was a great Catch Wrestler, a lot of the old time guys like Thesz, Gotch, etc were legitimate shoot fighters. My first submission fighting I learned was catch from a guy who owned a filling station in Bogard,MO.

ST

[KCSTRONGMAN]

The Gotch I was talking about was Frank. Did you do any cross-buttosk manuevers in your meet this weekend past, professor?
The style of wrestling Grandpa did when he was young was catch as catch can.
ET

I'm the lyrical Jesse James

[Al Myers]

The fight between Hack and Gotch was classic. I have read several different accounts of it over the years, some of which bordered on describing a todays pro wrasslin match. But to give a little credit to Hack in the first match – as he kept things “above board”. It was said that Gotch engaged in such unethical practices as oiling his body, rubbing oil in Hacks eyes, scratching, gouging, and once punched Hack in the nose!!! All of this was apparently ignored by the referee!!! haha Somebody ought to write a Daily News story on this fight since we are discussing Hackenschmidt.

I’m still waiting to see if anyone knows the exercise that I think is Hack’s greatest strength feat.

I’ve made a loin cloth out of one of my old white tshirts that I’m hoping that I can get the professor to wear tonight for the picture of the “real” Hack Lift. Dinoman

[dwagman]

OK Al, so it wasn’t his jumping feats with weights. How ’bout his one-armed snatches with 190+? That would exceed any of today’s USAWA/IAWA records regardless of weight class.

Dan

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[Al Myers]

I agree that is an impressive one arm snatch – but NOT his most impressive lift he did (in my opinion).

What he did I would question if ANYONE could do now.

[Chad Ullom]

Would it be his wrestlers bridge press of 311? That is pretty unreal!

[Al Myers]

Yes, Chad, that is the lift of his I was thinking about. That is also an official lift of the USAWA – its called the Pullover and Press with wrestlers bridge. But rules of the Pullover and Press apply, but the lifter must have only THREE contact points with the platform throughout the lift – head and both feet. This forces the pullover to be a true pullover. 311 pounds seems near impossible to me. Al

[dwagman]

Darnit Chad, you beat me to it. But I’d like to submit another lift that seems nearly impossible to me and impressive as all heck.

Hack was said to have cleaned 231.5 pounds. Then he somehow got the barbell centered into his right hand and jerked it overhead with only one hand. He did that weighing 190 pounds when he was only 20 years old (April 1898).

Is that crazy or what? Might this be a new USAWA lift?

Dan

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[Al Myers]

Well, I have to give the report of last night’s experiment in the gym trying to do the REAL Hack Lift. First of all, I could not get the professor to wear the loin cloth for the picture. It was all I could do to get him to take his knee sleeves off. Then he made a miserable attempt at it as he could not even bend down far enough with his hands together behind his back to really even grab the bar. After having a good laugh at him for his comical attempt, I gave it a try and was equally humiliated. I was able to get it to my buttocks, and then it got caught in one of Hack’s notorious Buttock-holds and would go no higher. I was hoping to get a good picture of the real hack lift for todays story, but it was a no-go.

I wonder if anyone could really do this lift as described? It seems near impossible to us from our experience in the gym last night. Dinoman

[dwagman]

I’m sooo disappointed&#8212about the loin cloth, that is.

Al, I’m wondering if we’re not making an assumption about the Hocke lift that’s incorrect. It seems that we’re assuming that the lift starts with the weight on the ground. But what evidence is there for that? Note that Willoughby’s description only states: “The ‘Hacke’ lift is performed by knee-bending on the toes while holding a barbell with the hands together behind the hips…” This description makes no mention as to how the barbell ended up in the lifter’s hands. Is it not possible that the lifter backed up to a rack that held the barbell, grasped it, then took a step out of the rack, and then did the Hocke lift?

The place I train at in Germany is a weightlifting club that was founded in 1907. Back then, it was actually a weightlifting and wrestling club and the office has some really cool old pictures of “the guys.” The weightlifters are largely gone, the wrestlers are definitely gone, and there are but a few hardcore guys left. This gym is rather primitive and has very old equipment. Among the equipment there are these very old free-standing racks at different heights. They amount to a tripod upon which you can place a barbell, about at knee height, another half way up the thigh. I could see such tripods being used back then to hold the barbell for curls, shrugs, etc.&#8212and perhaps the Hocke lift.

Allow me to digress…Nearby is a McFit Fitness-Studio, basically the German version of 24 Hr. Fitness. When the guys at my gym saw me train the one-armed c&j they wanted to make bets for a case of Bier about how long it would take the McFit people to kick me out if I did it over there. I said that within 3 reps some pencilneck with shiny muscles would run up to me and tell me I couldn’t do that there. We never followed through with this, maybe next time…

Dan

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[KCSTRONGMAN]

What I liked about the old timers were that alot of your strongmen were your wrestlers and your bodybuilders as well. Being strong was not exclusive of having a strong physique and being able to use that power to help you win wrestling matches. This is part of why I like to compete in strongman, powerlifting, HG, all-round, naha, etc. I think it is cool to be well rounded. We now live in a world with too much specialization, IMO. I want to be strong across the board, like the old timers-not in just one capacity.
ET

I'm the lyrical Jesse James

[Al Myers]

Dan – I suspect you are right in your assumption that the weight was picked off a rack or similiar structure to perform a Hocke Lift. Especially since most of the reported feats where done for reps instead of a max single, and in light of our dismal efforts last night of trying to do them from the platform. But the thought of this has caused me disillusion, and due to this suggestion from you has turned the Hocke Lift into some sort of mis-guided Cross Fit exercise in my mind. I doubt if I ever want to talk about it again….ever! haha

And ET, I agree wholeheartly with you on your latest post. I trained with weights for years purely trying to increase my performance in the Highland Games. My goals were to increase my strength athleticism so I could throw farther. This train of thought was how the old-timers approached their training as they were often involved in other athletic pursuits, like wrestling or boxing.

Great discussion here guys!!! Dinoman

[dwagman]

Well, it WAS a great discussion until Dinoman took it down the gutter by uttering the word Crossfit. See, now you made me do it. Sheesh…

d

—
Dan

For Body Intellect Brochure click here: https://www.icloud.com/keynote/0fcsokZWooW_1B1uZmL1AI5fA#BI-DW

Those who are enamored of practice without science
are like a pilot who goes onto a ship without rudder or
compass and never has any certainty to where he is going.
Leonardo Da Vinci; 1452-1519

[0722143772]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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