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[b]Quote from JWCIII on April 9, 2013, 09:12[/b]
I had thought about presses with the trap bar….what advantages would you say this would have over a straight bar. Looks like it would simulate the DB press or even log press position. thanks for posting…always looking for new ideas!

You’ve got to be 3 times tighter before you Push Press or Jerk. The ONLY contact point is your hands. Warm-up with the trap bar up to 65%-75% of your workout weight then switch to a straight bar. You are going to have a good time!! Those lifts with the straight bar will seem sooo easy. I have to drive my triceps onto my lats when I get ready(dip) to push overhead.
Also, the trap bar is more severe at exposing an arm weakness. With a straight bar, you can make a lift with an uneven lockout. The trap bar allows your hands to move more front to back(yes like dumbbell)than a barbell. If anything, if you move one hand forward the other tends to go back!! I seem to not make many uneven lifts with my UNtrapT bar. I feel forced to stay ‘straight under the weight’, grind ‘er out or don’t.
Not like the log at all. I’ve got some layback with a log trying to sit in my throat. A trap bar press is to a straight bar press like a trap bar deadlift is to straight bar deadlift. There’s not much need to move around the bar cuz’ there’s no bar to move around!! I think its great for teaching you to be tighter with your overhead lifting BUT I wouldn’t use it close to a meet. It’s kinda the opposite of lifting the Log which is way away from your COG. For Olympic lifters, they want to keep their elbows up when dipping before the Jerk. This is unnecessary with a trap bar. Actually, your hands are out to the sides of your shoulders so you can mash your triceps onto your lats when you dip. I know this is long but I’ve done ALOT of experimenting/working out with this bar.

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Consideration #1 I already had the sleeves from a bent bar.
Consideration #2 I DID NOT have it balanced from every angle.
Consideration #3 I had this done 3 years ago
Cost 225.00$
Had I known BEFOREHAND that I’d have to put close to the purchase price into it again there’s no friggin’ way I would’ve bought it. The jackass selling them was about as helpful as a screen door in a thunder storm. He was at the 2011 Heavy Lift Nationals in York. I was going to give him a piece of my mind right there but, being new to the USAWA, and competing in a USAWA event I thought it best to ignore him.
This bar has so much untapped potential in its non rackable, solid sleeve form. I would HIGHLY recommend getting this done if you can afford it!!

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Dan, I’m not talking about a general warm-up. This warm-up and training protocol is designed to make sure the disc don’t get lopsided due to just training the SLD. If your disc weren’t meant to deform to allow a greater ROM then why the hell do they?! It must be natural for the body to move this way. There must be things we can do to balance out the pressure(s) on the vertebral disc. If our bodies were designed to only work at the most efficient body positions, mankind would not be as far along as we are now.
What’s the science on this? IS there any science on training back and forth to balance out pressure on the disc?

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yep, wrote you back.

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Supersets, retro-gravity,rest-pause,seague,iso-tension,speed reps etc. How could ya forget!!

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WOW. May he rest in peace.

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Dan,
Sounds to me that warming up with working sets of Side Bends(straight or bent legged), then alternating sets of Stiff Legged Sit-Ups with Stiff Legged Deadlifts would help keep the vertebral disc in shape(pun intended). Seems like a good protocol, what do YOU think?
An exercise I came up with for alleviating tightness in my upper & mid back, seems like it would be helpful as well. I call it a Reverse Deadlift, a vertical traction exercise. Here’s a video I did awhile back.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzVr80ciPTE&feature=player_detailpage
Most times just getting into position seems to shift the spine.
Doing the OPPOSITE of an exercise makes you more aware of the original exercise. I’m forced to study the body position and order of exucution.
BTW, when I want to do the opposite of a Stiff Legged Deadlift, I do Sit Ups off a pullup bar. I hold on with the tops of my feet on top of the bar(good shin work). What an intenese burn in the Hip Flexors!!

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[b]Quote from tpr42345@aol.com on March 19, 2013, 20:07[/b]
No, Starr’s 666 national record deadlift was performed in the 198 class. See [url]http://www.liftinglarge.com/The-No-Deadlift-Deadlift-Program_ep_51-1.html[/url]

Of course this was during the early years of powerlifting and several years later Vince Anello did about 150 pounds more than Starr’s record while also lifting in the 198 class.

Thanks Tom, I thought it might actually be 165 or 181 but not 198!! Still a 3XBWT+ Dead ain’t too shabby. Vince Anello should’ve been tested…not for steroids but whether or not he was HUMAN!
I believe that after leaving Powerlifting for Olympic Lifting Shane Hamman said he could now pull 800+.
The arch back work in Olympic lifting would be a great ‘off season’ program for a Powerlifter.

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Dan,
Now, my main bone to pick with you regards your statement about as long as you don’t feel pain, it’s OK. Unfortunately, nothing could be farther from the truth. (Well furthest from that would be that if it DOES hurt, its ok?!?!)
Please take this to heart. I’d hate to see your passion for lifting being short-lived. (Too late for short lived, I’ve been doing this over 25 years!)

Also, I don’t want anybody to think that I’m bad-mouthing the old timers. The fact is that these guys were pioneers and flew by the bottom of their seats. They were also in one way or the other responsible for the birth of the scientific field of study known as exercise physiology. As much as we should respect the old timers, we should also accept where they were wrong.(so wrong that we STILL haven’t broken these 60,70,80,90,100 year old records? They must’ve done SOMETHING right!? Is anyone close to Saxon’s Arthur Lift or Bent Press, Rigoulot’s One Arm/Hand Snatch, Goerner’s One Arm Swing?)

Olympic lifters have made for some great Deadlifting:John Davis 705lbs, Bill Starr 666lb@165(?), Koklyaev won the Russian Nationals in Oylmpic Lifting. Here he is hitting 881lbs for 3 reps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSVV7d146FE&feature=player_detailpage

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Dan,
I disagree. Like you I’ve been in this game a LONG TIME. I do not have the formal education you have. I’ve abided by one simple rule when it comes to working out.
If my body does or can move that way without pain then, it’s OK. I want my training to prepare me for lifting in all sort of situations not just the semi-controlled enviornment of the gym. That’s why I love All-Round Lifting!! Many times we have to do things while in a less than ‘efficient’ body position. I’m sure the way I sleep has put some enormous shearing forces on my spine!! To me training in only ‘efficient’ body positions is worse than no training at all. You potentially build up mental and physical barriers to moving your body outside your norm.
Like you, I’ve done quite a bit of reading. I’ve been hearing about shearing forces for years. I believe these forces are to be ready for NOT ran away from. Much like when the science of Aerodynamics claimed that by their understanding, a Bumble bee should not be able to fly, a reevaluation of their understanding was in order. I believe a reevaluation of what our bodies are doing is in order.
I’d dare to say that more important than front to back mechanics is LEFT & RIGHT mechanics. Most of us are either right side dominant or left side dominant. Many folks who have low back injuries are due to a misalignment of the pelvis and spine often via the Quadratus Lumborum(QL). The QL not only connects to ALL 5 lumbar vertebrae but also both floating ribs. On right dominant folks, Right QL=too tight while LeftQL=too stretched out. Many years of talking to people and working with them has lead me to believe that injuries are left or right NOT FRONT OR BACK. Most inuries are felt on one side not both sides of the front or both sides of the back. Usually in training, if I feel the work on just one side, I know my alignment is off. I don’t care what type of pull or squat is being done, if yor spine and pelvis are out of whack then you proceed at your own peril.
Don’t get down on those old school lifters, many have lifts we STILL HAVEN’T BEEN ABLE TO BREAK A CENTURY LATER!!! Even if a SLD physically did nothing for your DL, it sure as hell does something for it MENTALLY. Being able to haul up 400+ on a SLD is quite a mental boost for regular DL.
That being said, ANY round back lifting needs plenty of warming up and proper alignment. For round back SLD, know how to use your lats. THE LATS THAT CONNECT TO YOUR PELVIS!! Warm-up with heavy-ish Side Bends with free arm behind head, going for a deep stretch to a) align you hips and spine b)get a feeling for the lats that go into the pelvis. When you round the back, you need to use those big cords of lats that attach into the pelvis to pull on. I believe strong abs will help control how round you go.
Dan, I say resurrect the SLD, just make sure you’re aligned properly, warmed up, abs are strong and know how to use your lats to pull yourself out of the hole.
Jim

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I hub lifted one of Frank’s York Deep Dish 45’s and he in turn used MY York Deep Dish 45’s that I just got. Been wanting to Hub Clean & Press a 45er for awhile.
Never done Kneeling Snatches before: VERY INTERESTING LIFT!
BTW, I had the best Kelly Snatches of my life Saturday. I don’t know why I was “on” but the meet is the time to be so. My boss asked me today when I’ll hit 200lbs!! Kinda freaked me out to hear. I know it seems kinda silly to be proud of 108 lbs but can you imagine ….200lbs=WOW.

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Yes, congratulations indeed!

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Thanks Ben,
What you didn’t see was edited out. My previous attempt was aborted due to automotive grease(don’t ask) on the left plate. Had to wipe plate and fingers off. I had a little concern going into the next attempt.
Knowing that you train grip quite fervently, I’ll also tell you that I’ve changed my ‘attitude’. Me being right handed=left grip not quite up to snuff. Recently, I’ve just been literally telling my left to stop fuckin’ around and pick it up. I may have two different hands but they get told what to do by THE SAME BRAIN!! This new attitude helped on this lift. I’ve noticed a dramatic increase in my left hand ability. Have you gone through something similar?

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That’s great! How long of a bar did you get?

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Al, the whole topic is kinda funny in that most regular gym goers don’t give a damn. Case in point:
Bought a competition Werksan bar 1 1/2 years ago. WOW!! A superb Olympic Lifting bar. Upon first getting the bar, I’d bring it to my cousin’s gym once a week. EVERYONE who tried it immediately knew it felt smooth. It was funny cuz at first they’d be skeptical. “What do you mean ‘try out the bar?'” was often expressed. These folks never gave it a thought that there’s something possibly something different to use. This bar became a BIG HIT whenever I brought it in. Are they or the gym in a position to drop almost a grand on just one bar? Nope.
Dedicated lifters that compete, salivate over a chance to get a ‘better bar’
On a related subject but not really, Rigoulot became the first to Clean & Jerk 400 and One Arm Snatched 250+ on a springy 10ft. bar. He knew how to use the whip to his advantage. Chances are he could not have repeated these lifts on a 7ft Olympic style bar.
Do you know what the diameter of the bar was? What ever happened to the bar? Maybe we could do some Exhibition lifts with a bar like his. The lifts could be called Clean & Jerk-Rigoulot Bar and One Arm Snatch-Rigoulot Bar. could be fun.

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